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Real History

About history of Kurdistan and middle east and the world.

Real History

PostAuthor: Kurdsta » Mon Nov 12, 2012 2:05 am

Kurdish history is very very complex, this is due to our people being layers of other peoples.
Our ancestors were the Sumerians, Hurrians, Mitannis, Urartians ( ur from sumer), Aryan tribes, Anatolians (not turks), Gutis, Elamites, Manneans, Alans and a few more. This based on the linguistic and geographical terms. The kurds are a very mixed people but to put it in simple terms we are a mixture of the Native peoples of our area and have aryan and eastern european (georgians e.t.c) influence. Armenians are pretty much kurds they are just christians and have formed a different identity to the kurds, they also have more of an european influence. their capital is yerevan which pretty much is yerewan coming from the wan region. Wan is a very kurdish name.

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The median tribes:

The Busae group is thought to derive from the Persian term buza meaning indigenous (i.e. not Iranian). Whether this was based on an originally Iranian term, or their own name, is unknown.

The second group is called the Paraetaceni, or Parae-tak-(eni) in Persian, and denotes nomadic inhabitants of the mountains of Paraetacene. This name recalls the Scythian Para-la-ti, the people of Kolaxis, believed to represent the common people in general, but whom Herodotus calls the "Royal Scythians".

The third group is called Stru­khat.

The fourth group is the Arizanti, whose name is derived from the words Arya (noble), and Zantu (tribe, clan).

The fifth group were the Budii, found also among the Black Sea Scythians as Budi-ni. Buddha was of the tribe Budha, the Saka (eastern Scythian) form of the name.

The sixth tribe were the Magi...They were a hereditary caste of priests of the Zurvanism religion that evolved out of Zoroastrianism. The name Magi implies a link with the Sumerians, who called their language Emegir, over time becoming simplified to Magi. Hungarian tradition also traces pre-European Magyar (Hungarian) ancestry back to the Magi. In time, the Sumerian-influenced religion of the Magi was suppressed in favour of a more purely Iranian form of Zoroastrianism, itself evolved from its somewhat dualist beginnings into the monotheistic faith that it is today (also known as Parsi-ism).

Kurds/ Mede soldiers always wore rounded caps or slightly pointed ones (not to be confused with assyrian ones)

http://www.taroscopes.com/miscellanous-pages/medes.html
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Baghdad was also built by the kurds, very long ago probably in the sumerian times its name means something on the lines of Court or Law like our modern day Dadga meaning court. The sumerians were based in modern day south iraq and kuwait but back then this land was fertile the sumerians eventually were invaded by the akkadians (assyrians) from the north of saudi. Eventually after the land became less fertile and their was not much water left the sumerians moved north (were their was other sumerians and natives living) and intergrated well into their society. The sumerians once again were invaded by the semetic-akkadians (assyrians) and renamed and burnt many cities. they based their capital in modern mosul back then they renamed it ninawa (remember they are invaders) they thought they could just stay their but the kurds reunited under Diako (founder of the median empire -greatest kurdish king however his name was mentioned 6000 years ago) and defeated the ass-yrians around 615 BC. :-D :-D after that the assyrians never reformed and have been homeless since. They can look to their arab brothers in the south were they belong and are very welcome :p

The Akkadians claimed everything to be theirs, they took the language, cuneiform, culture, religion and put their own twist on it.

In modern times the history in iraq only goes as back as the akkadian times and all the cities have been akkadified or arbabized. We have lost alot of our native land but nowadays they are shitholes beyond re-construction :/

However the Medes (biggest kurdish empire) were just a unifaction of all tribes in the kurdish regions. hamadan ( hagmatana - the place of meeting)

Zoroastrianism is basically a summary of all the religions practiced amongst our ancestors. We believed in one god (ahura mazda - which means awri mazin - which means fierce fire or hot fire) and frawahar ) fra - meaning alot and wahar meaning wealth) was his main angel. the religion was based on fire, water, air and earth. Good words Good thought Good deeds.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KUR ???? ???
??????
this could be our possible modern name?? ???
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Remember we are layers of the people who have come to our land in peace and have integrated. In modern times kurds as a whole are mixed pretty well we can tell today because in every part of Kurdistan you will find people that look the same. The only reason ones area or tribe may look different is because they have been marrying their own family and have kept their certain traits.

We also know kurds are mixed as a whole because the Zazas in the most western part of kurdistan speak a dialect almost identical to Hawramani ( eastern kurdistan- the language closest to our mother language Awesta)

Kurmanji also comes from the word Kur - son and magi- median tribe.
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Farsi comes from Parsis which now means Persian. the p could not be pronounced by arabs so it was changed and became farsi. farsi is kurdish, arabic and turkish mashed into a pile of shit and put on with a "classy" french american accent. Meeercy azizam. Persians are an ethnic minority in their own "country" the bulk of iranis population is azeri. Reza Shah was actually 3 quarters azeri he tried to be persian but he couldnt and tried to unify everyone in "iran" under the same name.
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Sassanis were the last kurds to rule an empire just the name alone proves its kurdish. No iranian has the name sassan but kurds do its my cousins names. The king Ardashir was from kermanshah. Also kermanshah holds one of the most significant reliefs surviving today. Yazdgurd was also kurdish. The sassanis were also a dynasty they embraced unity and ruled with an iron fist. prophet mohammeds teacher was a mugh (magi) a zoroastrian priest exiled from iran by the sassanis. Mohammeds teachings are based upon zoroastrianism.
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now my sources are mostly in books i can post pictures but i cannot be bothered unless i really have to. But this all does make sense any questions just ask me im more than happy to answer !!!

Peace

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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: jjmuneer » Mon Nov 12, 2012 5:32 pm

Georgians aren't Aryans. Kurdish indo-european ancestry comes from mostly Median and Scythian with the some possible parthian influence in the south-east. And Medes weren't "Native" to Kurdistan.

Do you have any primary sources for Kurds are Sumerian descended?
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: Kurdsta » Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:08 am

jjmuneer wrote:Georgians aren't Aryans. Kurdish indo-european ancestry comes from mostly Median and Scythian with the some possible parthian influence in the south-east. And Medes weren't "Native" to Kurdistan.

Do you have any primary sources for Kurds are Sumerian descended?


I never stated that Georgians were aryans I said they are Eastern Europeans. No they come from aryan tribes that have settled in various parts of Kurdistan. In India, Tibet, Iran, Afghanistan and Kurdistan their is signs of aryan "invaders". This proves they have migrated from where their home land is thought to be (modern day Ukraine) and have had 2 major migrations one going through Asia and back to Kurdistan and one going through Kurdistan to Iran.

Medes are a unification of 6 Kurdish tribes, the Medes formed a state under king diako and ruled over Persian, Parthians e.t.c. It clearly states that in my 2nd paragraph.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=arya ... sVRwp_aI2M:

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=arya ... JVnaBDvYrM:

Their isn't many primary sources but if you know your history well enough you can find Sumerian elements everywhere in Kurdistan. Hawler for example it was built by the natives (ubaids then formed to Sumerians) its real name is ur bilum. It has always been a Kurdish city has it not? Urmieh once again Ur means city. We know Ur was the capital of sumeria. Ararat comes from Urartu the kingdom of wan. K ur d once again ur. Look at Gobekli tepe and compare their reliefs to of the Sumerians they are very similar. Evidence is everywhere the median reliefs/depiction are based upon Sumerians. Awesta the oldest known Kurdish language was written in cuneiform.

Ill ty and find a primary source but it speaks for itself.

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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: Kurdsta » Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:42 am


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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: thesunchild » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:27 pm

Please don’t believe in lies and propaganda on internet. We Kurds are Umman Manda , Medians (children of god) and native to Kurdistan (Media). Ancient Medians (Aryans) were also native to Kurdistan.

The thing is that we Kurds are a little bit mixed with the Semitic females from the Levant (Jews) and Arabia (Chaldeans).


We are Aryans, children of the great Medes and we are native to Kurdistan!
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: Kurdsta » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:48 pm

thesunchild wrote:Please don’t believe in lies and propaganda on internet. We Kurds are Umman Manda , Medians (children of god) and native to Kurdistan (Media). Ancient Medians (Aryans) were also native to Kurdistan.

The thing is that we Kurds are a little bit mixed with the Semitic females from the Levant (Jews) and Arabia (Chaldeans).


We are Aryans, children of the great Medes and we are native to Kurdistan!


Don't believe what lies? This is the truth ....

Medes is simply another another name for Kurds back then, we are not children of god (we are not superior to anyone else)
You don't know what your talking about aryans are invaders that have assimilated and have formed the Kurdish identity to what it is today....

The only Semitic influence we should have is from Arab invaders not Levantine people or Jews... Levantine people are Syrian, Lebanese, Palestinian....

Lmao Chaldeans from Arabia?? Chaldean are native Babylonians with Kurdish influence...

Btw my only source of the Internet is the median tribes the rest is of from books, you don't know what your saying... The history I'm talking about pre dates the Medes... They only appeared around 800bc their is many other parts of Kurdish history you don't know...

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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: thesunchild » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:59 pm

No, you're spreading lies!

We have nothing to do with the Summerians, Aryans were not the invaders. Original Aryans came from Arya-Veya, the original homeland of the Aryans and it was in the mountains of Kurdistan.

The Medes were native to Kurdistan.

Chaldeans came from the south, Arabia and the Levant. They were Semitic folks and belonged to hg. J1 & E.
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: jjmuneer » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:30 pm

Kurdsta wrote:
jjmuneer wrote:Georgians aren't Aryans. Kurdish indo-european ancestry comes from mostly Median and Scythian with the some possible parthian influence in the south-east. And Medes weren't "Native" to Kurdistan.

Do you have any primary sources for Kurds are Sumerian descended?


I never stated that Georgians were aryans I said they are Eastern Europeans. No they come from aryan tribes that have settled in various parts of Kurdistan. In India, Tibet, Iran, Afghanistan and Kurdistan their is signs of aryan "invaders". This proves they have migrated from where their home land is thought to be (modern day Ukraine) and have had 2 major migrations one going through Asia and back to Kurdistan and one going through Kurdistan to Iran.

Medes are a unification of 6 Kurdish tribes, the Medes formed a state under king diako and ruled over Persian, Parthians e.t.c. It clearly states that in my 2nd paragraph.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=arya ... sVRwp_aI2M:

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=arya ... JVnaBDvYrM:

Their isn't many primary sources but if you know your history well enough you can find Sumerian elements everywhere in Kurdistan. Hawler for example it was built by the natives (ubaids then formed to Sumerians) its real name is ur bilum. It has always been a Kurdish city has it not? Urmieh once again Ur means city. We know Ur was the capital of sumeria. Ararat comes from Urartu the kingdom of wan. K ur d once again ur. Look at Gobekli tepe and compare their reliefs to of the Sumerians they are very similar. Evidence is everywhere the median reliefs/depiction are based upon Sumerians. Awesta the oldest known Kurdish language was written in cuneiform.

Ill ty and find a primary source but it speaks for itself.

And who were the people living in Andronovo? The Indo-Iranians or Aryan people. Its highly unlikely they were all Nordic as people try and make out, a majority probably was.

And that is a strawman argument. In real life if you have no real evidence, you cannot claim "well it probably is still true". Doesn't work like that I'm afriad. 'kur' doesn't mean we descend from them.
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: thesunchild » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:50 pm

The so called ‘Aryans’ in Eastern Europe were always Europoid. Those barbaric hunter-gatherer subhuman folks were Aryanised by the true Aryans from Kurdistan. Aryans in Kurds were always like Kurds.

Slavic tribes were never Aryan and they will never be.


I’m 100% sure that modern Kurdish DNA is still the closest DNA to the ancient Medes you can get. And the Medes were greatest and the true Aryans, not wannabe folks…
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: Kurdsta » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:55 pm


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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: jjmuneer » Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:58 pm

thesunchild wrote:No, you're spreading lies!

We have nothing to do with the Summerians, Aryans were not the invaders. Original Aryans came from Arya-Veya, the original homeland of the Aryans and it was in the mountains of Kurdistan.

The Medes were native to Kurdistan.

Chaldeans came from the south, Arabia and the Levant. They were Semitic folks and belonged to hg. J1 & E.

Haplogroups don't really tell you alot about a person's DNA, it is autosomal DNA that does.
But since you insist, J1* is actually non-semitic, actually found in quite of Kurds, and the caucasus. You forget R1a-z93, which is actually the indo-iranian marker, seems to be high in central asia than Kurdistan. :-D
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: jjmuneer » Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:00 pm

Kurdsta wrote:https://www.google.com.au/search?q=sumerian+sun+disk&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari#biv=i|1;d|Y-Pcv0MRPZvA1M: this is exactly frawahar

Thats nothing to do with the farahvar, because it isn't a sun disk lol.
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: thesunchild » Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:09 pm

jjmuneer wrote:But since you insist, J1* is actually non-semitic, actually found in quite of Kurds, and the caucasus. You forget R1a-z93, which is actually the indo-iranian marker, seems to be high in central asia than Kurdistan. :-D

I've seen professional autosomal DNA result and according to that Kurds have the most of so the called ''Persian" component.

Other autosomal results by amateur bloggers are bullshit.


Semitic subclade of J1-something along with hg. E was part of the original Semites. Kurds have low percentage of hg. R1a because we have some of hg. 'I'. without hg. 'I' we would have higher percentage of R1a.


Also, Aryans were mostly J2a & R1a folks, not only R1a.


And it means nothing that R1a is higher in Central Asia than in Kurdistan. R1b is also higher in Europe than in West Asia, but R1b is still from West Asia.
Last edited by thesunchild on Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: thesunchild » Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:14 pm

Image

Image

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/showthread ... al-Results


'Persian' actually a 'Median' component is a true ARYAN component1
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Re: Real History

PostAuthor: jjmuneer » Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:42 pm

thesunchild wrote:
jjmuneer wrote:But since you insist, J1* is actually non-semitic, actually found in quite of Kurds, and the caucasus. You forget R1a-z93, which is actually the indo-iranian marker, seems to be high in central asia than Kurdistan. :-D

I've seen proffesional autosomal DNA result and according to that kurds have the most of so the called ''Persian" component.

Other autosomal results by amateur bloggers are bullshit.


Semitic subclade of J1-something together with hg. E was part of the original Semites. Kurds have low percentage of hg. R1a because we have some of hg. 'I'. without hg. 'I' we would have higher percentage of R1a.

Also Aryans were mostly J2a & R1a folks, not only R1a.

It means nothing that R1a is higher in Central Asia than in Kurdistan. R1b is also higher in Europe than in West Asia, but R1b is still from West Asia.


Well I was talking about Dodecad's calculator which is more reliable. West asia is basically indo-Iranian or includes it. 'Persian' comonent in DNA tribes is not Median lol, a better term would be 'indo-iranian'. Considering Turkmens also have a high 'Persian' component, relating to pre-Turkic central asia.

R1a in central asia is of the z93 type, which is indo-Iranian, so it does mean something. It means it orginated from there. R1a-z83 which is found in Eastern Europe is even more higher, which is also corrobates with the yamma culture.

Anyways lets take out haplogroups for a minute. Plus paternal lingeages can get killed off and it can change as dramtically and rapdily within a generation, people even think the Celts were probably R1a of some sort, but many Celts were killed off fighting the romans. If Kurds are "true aryans", it wouldn't explain why Kurds have high Med admixture and South-west Asian admixture. On Dodecad Kurds are a average of 14-18%. Though the west Asian component is around 45-60%.

R1b in Europe is of a different subclade to R1b in western Asia. R1b1b probably dominated as a paternal haplogroup over time, marginalzing the others. As I said before though autusomal DNA is more important.

What is your 23andme by the way? You spend too much time at wikipedia.
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