Banning the use of mothertongue!

[piskrt]

2 news about the use of mothertongue in private in Europe. One of them is from dw-tv, the other is from a turkish newspaper.


Debate Rages Over German Language-Only School

A secondary school in Berlin has decided to ban Turkish and other foreign languages spoken by its pupils in an attempt to improve German language skills at the immigrant-dominated facility.


The ban has unleashed a heated public debate about foreigner integration in German society with some politicians arguing the move is counterproductive and discriminates against foreigners.



School authorities, however, claim their students' command of German has improved markedly over the past few months.



Until about six months ago, the mix of languages to be heard in the schoolyard of Berlin's Herbert-Hoover School was of truly Babylonian multi-tongue dimensions.



The school is located in the immigrant-dominated district of Wedding. Ninety percent of the school's students have immigrant parents, with Turks in the majority followed by smaller groups of Arabs, Croats, Russians and Pakistanis.



Since September of last year, however, they are not allowed to speak in their native tongue at school. The rule has become enshrined in the school's code of conduct, agreed to by parents' representatives and school authorities. School headmaster Jutta Steinkamp says her pupil’s command of German has improved substantially.



Language a basis for efficient integration, says school head




Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: Teachers say that the emphasis on German helps kids integrate.
"We have introduced this ban to enable our students to take part in German society through speaking and understanding the language properly," Steinkamp said. "Knowing the language is a precondition for successful integration and we've been making much progress in the past few months with regard to our students' language skills."



But some politicians want Herbert-Hoover-School's "ban" on non-German language to itself be "banned." Members of the Left Party and the environmentalist Greens accuse Berlin's school authorities of discriminating against immigrants. Özcan Mutlu is of Turkish origin himself, and serves as the Green's spokesman for education.



"I think this is an inappropriate means because it says that foreign languages are not welcome at this school." he said. "It's unbelievable that parents who are aiming to register their children at this school have to sign papers that basically ban their children from speaking their own language. The goal behind all this may be correct but the way towards achieving it isn’t."



School admissions up as support grows




Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: Some students believe the ban is good for their future prospects.
Herbert Hoover School has seen school the number of applications rise by 20 percent in recent months, and it enjoys nationwide support from teachers' associations. And some students believe the ban may be good for their future.



"I find this quite all right," said one student, born of Turkish immigrants, "because in later life we'll need German much more than Turkish. If you want to learn a profession and earn a living knowing German is absolutely necessary."



In spite of the criticism, school authorities all over Germany are now thinking of adopting the model of Berlin's Herbert Hoover School. They see a chance to help come to grips with the problem of rising unemployment and poverty among Turks and other large immigrant groups.



According to a recent survey the risk of immigrant pupils leaving school without a certificate is three times higher than for native German pupils. The prime reason, the report says: a lack of basic language skills.

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Spor salonunda Türkçe yasağı

Erkan TOKGÖZOĞLU / BİELEFELD

Almanya’nın başkenti Berlin’de bir okulun, teneffüste Almanca dışında bir dil konuşulmasını yasaklaması, bir politikacının ise "Yasağa uymayanlar okul bahçesini süpürsün" demesinin ardından, şimdi de bir spor salonu Türkçe’yi yasakladı. Bielefeld kentinde, spor yaparken aralarında Türkçe konuşan Dilan Nakipoğlu-Floth ile Volkan Aksu’un üyelikleri iptal edildi.

AVRUPA’da yabancılara ve kendi dillerini kullanmalarına dönük sert uygulamalara bir yenisi daha eklendi. Hollanda’da sokakta Flemenkçe dışında dil konuşulmaması talebinin ardından, Almanya’nın başkenti Berlin’de bir okulda teneffüslerde Türkçe konuşulmasının yasaklanması, bir politikacının da "Yasağa uymayanlar okul bahçesini süpürsünler" önerisinden sonra, anadil yasağı yeni bir boyuta ulaştı. Almanya’nın Bielefeld kentinde bir spor salonu da Türkçe’yi yasakladı.

Bielefeld’deki "Aktuelle Fitness" adlı spor salonu, antrenman sırasında Türkçe konuşan müşterilerinden Dilan Nakipoğlu-Floth (28) ile Alman ordusunda sivil askerlik yapan arkadaşı Volkan Aksu’un (22) üyeliklerini iptal etti. Salon yetkililerinin, üyelik iptalinden sonra verdiği çıkış kağıdının üzerine "Kendi istekleriyle spor salonundan ayrıldılar" diye not düşmesi de şaşkınlık yarattı.

Eşi Alman olan bir çocuk annesi Dilan Nakipoğlu-Floth, konuyla ilgili şunları söyledi:

"Birkaç hafta önce aylık 41 Euro aidatı olan bu spor salonuna kayıt yaptırdık. Başlarken de onların yanında Volkan ile aramızda hep Türkçe konuştuk. Burada böyle bir yasak olduğu şeklinde hiçbir şey söylemediler. Yoksa zaten başlamazdık. Buraya dördüncü kez geliyorduk. Aletlerde çalışırken bir yandan da Türkçe sohbet ediyorduk. O sırada yanımıza kadın antrenörlerden biri geldi. Bize Türkçe değil de Almanca konuşmamızı söyledi. Beynimden vurulmuşa döndüm. Ben de ’Anadilim Türkçe tabi ki Türkçe konuşacağım’ diye cevap verdim. Salon sahibiyle konuşup bize döneceğini söyledi. Daha sonra hiç tanımadığımız bir kişi gelip iki dosya kağıdını önümüze atıp ’Bunları imzalayın ve çıkıp gidin’ deyince şaşırıp kaldık. Biz de imzalamayacağımızı söyledik. Sözlü olarak tartıştık. Çıkış nedenimizi yazılı olarak vermelerini istedik. Ancak vermediler. Ben de eşim Marcel’e telefon ederek spor salonu ile yaptığım anlaşmayı alıp gelmesini istedim. Baktılar ki işin peşini bırakmayacağız, bu sefer de alttan almaya başlayıp ’Biz sadece rica etmiştik’ dediler. Bunu kabullenmemiz imkansızdı. Olayın peşini bırakmayacağım. Ayrıca suç duyurusunda da bulunacağım."

SALONUN AVUKATI NE DEDİ

Haber Bielefeld’deki Westfalen Blatt adlı bölge gazetesinde de "Spor stüdyosunda Almanca zorunluluğu" adı altında yer aldı. Gazeteye açıklama yapan fitnes salonunun avukatı Hans Geisser ise, "Biz bütün müşterilerimizin birbirleriyle ne konuştuklarını anlamasını istiyoruz. Eğer bir İngiliz İngilizce konuşsaydı ona da Almanca konuşması ricasında bulunurduk. Ayrıca sözleşmenin tehdit sonucu feshedildiği gibi bir durum yok" diye konuştu.

Kendimi entegre olmuş görüyorum

Arkadaşı Volkan Aksu ile spor salonu üyeliği iptal edilen Dilan Nakipoğlu-Floth "Bir butik işletiyorum ve kendimi Almanya’ya entegre olmuş olarak görüyorum. Akıcı şekilde Almanca konuşuyorum. Bir Alman’la evliyim ve küçük kızımız Alman kreşine devam ediyor. Bir spor salonunun yetişkin müşterilerinin ana dilinde konuşmalarını yasaklanması çok çirkin" dedi.

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It seems the EU countries are not so democratic. What do you think?

[Vladimir]

Turkey is practising this for years. Germany probable looked to Turkey for this new regulations. Difference is, that this is only one school and in Turkey there are thousands of schools.

[Piling]

And it is not the same thing to same foreign language at school to foreign migrants than to do it to its own citizens. Turks have chose to live in Germany, why they don't learn German ? There are a lot of Turkish schools in their own country. Kurds did not chose to be ruled by Turkey, and languages courses in KUrdish are banned for children in their own country. Just if you are an adult and you should pay for that.

[piskrt]

I guess you have not read the second one. The second one is about the banning of non-german languages in a fitness center.

[Piling]

Fitness ? horrible Then people are going to sweat in German and not in Turkish, that is pathetic...

[zurderer]

And it is not the same thing to same foreign language at school to foreign migrants than to do it to its own citizens. Turks have chose to live in Germany, why they don't learn German ? There are a lot of Turkish schools in their own country. Kurds did not chose to be ruled by Turkey, and languages courses in KUrdish are banned for children in their own country. Just if you are an adult and you should pay for that.

so what about second generation, third one? are they much different than kurds?

They had no chance to choose, they borned at germany as a turk.

or dont you think even second third or fourth generation are natives of germany or france? isnt this a little fasism?

what about half-germans half turks? are they natives like kurds or nots?

how many years should be pass to call immigrants as natives.

I think fasism is still at the heart of europeans.

[Piling]

I think fasism is still at the heart of europeans.

Yeap. Sure. For that reason all anti-fascist oprressed masses from the world run to live in Europe.

Well 2nd or 3rd generation of Turks living in Germany can come back in Turkey if they want. They are not like Kurds, they have their country and their state.

[zurderer]

Yeap. Sure. For that reason all anti-fascist oprressed masses from the world run to live in Europe.

well reason is not because europea is not fasist, but you got a lot money at there.(after all you destroyed their homes) Should I remind you rebellion at france?

Well 2nd or 3rd generation of Turks living in Germany can come back in Turkey if they want. They are not like Kurds, they have their country and their state.[/

They have their country and this is germany. what the hell are you talking? maybe kurds at turkey should go north iraq after all they have their country and state.

you should respect and care your own citizens more, instead of caring about kurdish people.

[Piling]

My own citizens ? lol much of "Turkish migrants" in France are Kurds. The I support strongly them if they want to learn Kurdish.

And in France it is not forbidden to talk a foreign language. French is the first language at school. But if you want to learn another one at college (12-18 years old) you can.

I don't approve nor disapprove German policy concerning Turkish, I don't know the case, and I don't care. But I find very funny that a Turk complains about his forbidden language, for the same will probably approve the ban of Kurdish in Turkey. Turks in Europe have to learn that you are always the "minority of some people", unfortunately it does not change their point of view about the Kurdish issue !

[tomjez]

And in France it is not forbidden to talk a foreign language. French is the first language at school. But if you want to learn another one at college (12-18 years old) you can.

That's true. But it is almost impossible to learn regional languages (like mine, Breton language) out of private schools regularly attacked by "associations of worried citizens" who fear separatism.

No no, it's not turkey it's France.

[Piling]

I don't care of Britton separatists be sure

[tomjez]

Of course not, no one really do! But still, if you ask cultural rights you will have M.P to say "NO, it will be the end of the republic! the beginning of separatism and tribal identity!"

totally hypocritical, but that's french political culture...and why I will never feel french!

[Piling]

I mean that I am not against an independant Britania, nor Corsica, etc. I don't care in fact. You know that Parisians never care of countries out of Paris.

[tomjez]

Yeah I'm aware, but still they can't understand why they don't want to be rueld by Paris! It's the center of the world and "le reste de la gaule c'est bon pour les sangliers"....

[tomjez]

Yeah I'm aware, but still they can't understand why they don't want to be rueld by Paris! It's the center of the world and "le reste de la gaule c'est bon pour les sangliers"....