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COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

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COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Diri » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:04 am

BalochEhr wrote:
Diri wrote:
BalochEhr wrote:Diri tell me, what exactly means in Kurdi " Ba Khairati"?



It's the same in Kurdish too, bira ...

Bi xêr hatî...

Read: "Be xer hati"

:)

So it means "Welcome" in Kurdi?


Yes bira - it means "You come with blessings" - but "khair" is Arabic (meaning: "blessing", "good", "enhancement" etc.) - and is used by most peoples of the Middle East...

If you want to say the same in "pure" Kurdish - you should say "Xoş hatî" ("Khosh hati") or "Xas hatî" ("Khas hati")... :)

Can you translate these words to Balochi and Brahui for me, please (?):

Table
Spoon
Sun
Moon
Hand
Earth
Guest

Thank you :)
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COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

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Balochistan - A Forgotten Country

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:05 pm

Thanks Diri Kurd, for transilating. In Balochi it is called "Wash Hati" in Brahui "Khoash Basos" or plural "Khoash Basore" and "Ba Khairhati,you welcome".
In Balochi:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Balochi origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Roch.
Moon=Mah.
Hand=Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Dagar or Digar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.

In Brahui:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Brahui origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Dae/Dahe.
Moon=Toohbe/Toohbae.
Hand=Dooh,Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Daghar or Dighar or Deghar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.
Last edited by BalochEhr on Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Country

PostAuthor: Diri » Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:04 pm

BalochEhr wrote:Thanks Diri Kurd, for transilating. In Balochi it is called "Wash Hati" in Brahui "Khoash Basos" or plural "Khoash Basore" and "Ba Khairhati,you welcome".
In Balochi:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Balochi origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Roch.
Moon=Mah.
Hand=Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Dagar or Digar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.

In Brahui:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Brahui origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Dae/Dahe.
Moon=Toohbe/Toohbae.
Hand=Dooh,Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Daghar or Dighar or Deghar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.


Thank you. Here are the Kurdish (Kurmancî) translations:

Table = Mase
Spoon = Kewçî
Sun = Roj
Moon = Meh/Heyv
Hand = Dest
Earth = Cîhan / Erd
Guest = Mêvan

These look very similar to Balochi... But not so much to Brahui...
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Country

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Sat Dec 29, 2007 7:21 pm

Diri wrote:
BalochEhr wrote:Thanks Diri Kurd, for transilating. In Balochi it is called "Wash Hati" in Brahui "Khoash Basos" or plural "Khoash Basore" and "Ba Khairhati,you welcome".
In Balochi:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Balochi origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Roch.
Moon=Mah.
Hand=Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Dagar or Digar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.

In Brahui:
Table=Maze,Takht(Takht also means stage)Char-Pacha.
Spoon=there is no Brahui origion name for it but we call it Chamcha.
Sun=Dae/Dahe.
Moon=Toohbe/Toohbae.
Hand=Dooh,Dast and Basqe/Bask.
Earth=Daghar or Dighar or Deghar.
Guest=Mehman and Bahot.


Thank you. Here are the Kurdish (Kurmancî) translations:

Table = Mase
Spoon = Kewçî
Sun = Roj
Moon = Meh/Heyv
Hand = Dest
Earth = Cîhan / Erd
Guest = Mêvan

These look very similar to Balochi... But not so much to Brahui...

You are right, infact Balochi and Brahui are similar to each other and Kurdi is more similar to Balochi.
Would you tell me what means "Barak" in Kurdi ,and the translations in Kurdi of:
Poem
Music
Child
Gun
Refuge
Mister(Mr)
Women
Men
Speak
Wife
Husband
Land (not earth)
Alert
Goat
Sheep and
Sord

I asked a lot... :lol:
Thanks in advance! :)
and i forget we also pronunce "Guest" as Mevan but write it Mehaman.
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Country

PostAuthor: Diri » Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:26 pm

Poem = Şeîr (Arabic) / Helbest (Kurdish)
Music = Saz / Mûzîk (European)
Child = Piçûk / Mindal / Zarok
Gun = Tifeng / Çek
Refugee = Penahende / Koçer /
Mister(Mr) = Axa / Xan (Turkic)
Woman = Jinik / Afret
Man = Mêrik / Piyaw
Speak = Axiftin / Qise kirdin
Wife = Jin / Xêzan
Husband = Mêr / Piyaw
Land (not earth) = Erd = Land / Cîhan = World - both can mean "Earth"
Alert = Agahdar
Goat = Bizin
Sheep = Pez / Mer
Sword = Şîr / Şemşîr

Berik? Berik means "Rug" in Kurdish... :)
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Country

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Sun Dec 30, 2007 10:45 am

In Balochi meanings are:
Poem=Soht/Sot(also used for song)
Music=Saz
Child=Zahg, Chuck, Gowando
Gun=Toupak
Refugee=Bahoht, Begiss
Mister(Mr)=Waja, Khan, Mir
Woman=Zalbool, Zal, Jinek(girl)
Man=Mard, Mardak, Nareena
Speak=Haber, Gap-o-Trhan
Wife=Jinen,Zaifa
Husband=Mard
Land=Digar, Earth=Dogniya, Univers=Jihan
Alert=Ahga/Aga or Haga
Goat=Buz,Pachin
Sheep=Pas, Mesh
Sword=Zam, Zamkh, Shamsheer.
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Colony

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:17 pm

To Parzin and Diri,
In Balochi cannon is also called "Toop" and the the gun is called Toupek. But in Brahui language we Baloch people call the gun "Toufek", isn't Kurmanji dailect is bit closer to Brahui? Well how many Kurdi dailects are there?

The Balochi meanings:

Star=Estar,Estal
Now=Noon, Nee
Stay=Bosht, Boshtae, in eatern Balochi its called Koshte.
Go=Bera
Come=Beya
Bird=Murg
Beautiful=Bradar,Zeba
Water=Ap ,in eastern Balochi its called=Af
Sky=Asman
Universe=Jahan, "Kainat(Perso-Arabic word)"

The Brahui Meanings:
Star=Estar,Eastal
Now=Dasa
Stay=Sal, Salek, Salae
Go=Da, En, Enak
Come=Ba, Barek
Bird=Chuk
Beautiful=Zeba, Bradar
Water=Dir
Sky=Asman
Universe=Jahan
Last edited by BalochEhr on Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Balochistan - A Forgotten Colony

PostAuthor: Diri » Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:05 pm

BalochEhr wrote:To Parzin and Diri,
In Balochi cannon is also called "Toop" and the the gun is called Toupek. But in Brahui language we Baloch people call the gun "Toufek", isn't Kurmanji dailect is bit closer to Brahui? Well how many Kurdi dailects are there?

The Balochi meanings:

Star=Estar
Now=Noon
Stay=Bosht
Go=Bera
Come=Beya
Bird=Murg
Beautiful=Bradar,Zeba
Water=Ap
Sky=Asman
Universe=Jahan, "Kainat(Perso-Arabic word)"

The Brahui Meanings:
Star=Estar
Now=Dasa
Stay=Sal
Go=Da, En
Come=Ba, Barak
Bird=Chuk
Beautiful=Zeba, Bradar
Water=Dir
Sky=Asman
Universe=Jahan


Kurdish has two language branches: Pehlewanî & Kurdmancî!


Pehlewanî = Zazakî
(including Dimilî and Kirmanckî) and Goranî (including Feylî, Kelhûrî, Lekî and Hewramî)
Kurdmancî = Soranî (with all sub-dialects) and Kirmancî (with all sub-dialects)

Balochi is closer to Kurdmancî Kurdish (Soranî & Kurmancî). Goranî Kurdish dilaects are close to Soranî - but Zazakî is very different from Kurmancî and Soranî... So a Zazakî nationalist movement has grown the last decades...

English / Kurdish
Star / Stêr, Estêre
Now / Nehe, Êsta
Stay / Mabe, Mawe
Go / Here, Biro
Come / Were
Bird / Cucik, Çûk
Beautiful / Delal, Rind, Ciwan, Bedev
Water / Av, Aw
Sky / Esman
Universe / Kehkeşan


I speak Kurmancî - and I am not 100% sure if the Soranî Kurdmancs use the same names for "bird" and "universe"...


75-80% of all Kurds speak Kurdmancî dialects (Soranî & Kurmancî)... Only about 20-25% speak Pehlewanî dialects of Kurdish...
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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Johny Bravo » Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:32 pm

@diri

I loved the "kurdmanc" terme, it makes more easy to show the people, that Sorani and Kirmancî are the same language.

@baloch

The "x" in the kurdish-zaza-azeri Alphabet means the "kh" loud. It is better, to write in the future "x".

Special northwest-iranian elements in balochi:

balochi: zamad, zanteg, asen
kurdish: zava, zanîn, esin
zazaki: zama, zanayene, asin

but persian: damat, danîstan, ahen

z /s = northwest, d / h = southwest

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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Johny Bravo » Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:34 pm

here is a uncomplete balochi - english dictionary:

http://www.ijunoon.com/balochidic/

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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Diri » Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:34 pm

Johny Bravo wrote:@diri

I loved the "kurdmanc" terme, it makes more easy to show the people, that Sorani and Kirmancî are the same language.



Yes - it makes more sense... And it's not my "invention". :wink:

Kurds in North Kurdistan, especially - still say "Kurmancî" when meaning "Kurd" - when they ask for example "Are you Kurdish" they say "Tu Kurmancî?"...

Did you know that?
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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Johny Bravo » Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:16 pm

Diri wrote:
Yes - it makes more sense... And it's not my "invention". :wink:

Kurds in North Kurdistan, especially - still say "Kurmancî" when meaning "Kurd" - when they ask for example "Are you Kurdish" they say "Tu Kurmancî?"...

Did you know that?

yes i knowed it, therefore the term "kurmanc brange" for sorani and kurmanci brings confusion. then the people think that sorani is also a kurmanci dialect etc.

btw. the baloci "wash" is in zazaki "wesh", in kurdish: xwesh, persian: xwosh. english = fine
baloci "burz" is in zazaki "berz", kurdish: bilind, persian: bulend. english = high
baloci "wardeg" is in zazaki: werdene, kurdish: xwarin, persian: xwordan. english = eat
baloci "gush" is in zazaki "vac", in kurdish: bêj, in persian: guy. see the parallels between "j" and "sh".

sadly the balochs became some indian influence. :( therefore they dont use as example "wast (zazaki and in my opinion the real pure baloch word herefore!) - xwest (kurdish) - xwast (persian)" for "want", they use the urdu word: lot :(

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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:24 pm

To Diri,
I like it, for creating a new topic in this forum about Balochi and Kurdi.

To Johny Bravo,
Well we write Balochi in Arabic script, so i have no idea which Roman alphabet is suitable for a particular sound. You are right X is used for "KH" sound( which is also banned in Turkey :( ). But i will use or write in my own conventional way, its a bit easy for my.
You have written some Balochi words:
zamad=which is also called zamas. zanteg=which is also called zante,zanin,zano and in eastern Balochi zaneen. asen, which word is this or its "asen for easy" "asen for iron" if its for iron then iron is called ahen in Balochi.
burz is alos called bala and bulind in eastern Balochi/western too.
(wardeg) it is "warte, did you eat it", "wartege, did you eat it or finished", "wartun, i eat it,finished" and "bor, eat!"
You are right that Balochi language now days is Indian(Urdu) influenced a lot, and Brahui language too. Like Kurdi(all branches) have been influenced by their occupiers, Persian, Turkish and Arabic.
You said we(Baloch) use Urdu a lot: we dont use "Kh"!!! Dear listen Baloch people dont use intentionally or by will the language of occupier, be it Persian, Urdu or Pashtu. Baloch people use "Kh" a lot, in Rakhshani dailect(western Balochi) we called the "want" khwast or khowast and in Makkurani dailect(also western Balochi) "want" is called wast.
Balochi meanings:
Want=wahag(desire,lust),lutin/loteen(i want), khwast/wast(request) and dastbandi(also for request).
wwooohha i forget!! about the word "asen" what you mean by this word iron or easy? i will confirm it that is iron called asen in "traditional" Balochi.
Last edited by BalochEhr on Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: Johny Bravo » Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:35 pm

BalochEhr wrote:To Diri,
I like it, for creating a new topic in this forum about Balochi and Kurdi.

To Johny Bravo,
Well we write Balochi in Arabic script, so i have no idea which Roman alphabet is suitable for a particular sound. You are right X is used for "KH" sound( which is also banned in Turkey :( ). But i will use or write in my own conventional way, its a bit easy for my.
You have written some Balochi words:
zamad=which is also called zamas. zanteg=which is also called zante,zanin,zano and in eastern Balochi zaneen. asen, which word is this or its "asen for easy" "asen for iron" if its for iron then iron is called ahen in Balochi.

hi i meaned "iron", yes. in the baloch. dict. stands: ahen and asen.

You said we(Baloch) use Urdu a lot: we dont use "Kh"!!! Dear listen Baloch people dont use intentionally or by will the language of occupier, be it Persian, Urdu or Pashtu. Baloch people use "Kh" a lot, in Rakhshani dailect(western Balochi) we called the "want" khwast or khowast and in Makkurani dailect(also western Balochi) "want" is called wast.
Balochi meanings:
Want=wahag(desire,lust),lutin/loteen(i want), khwast/wast(request) and dastbandi(also for request).

interesant. balochi and zazaki have made a systemetical loudshift of old iranian hv- to w-.
see: ward, wash.
in old iranian was this: hvaretha, Vahishta

but persian and kurdish make a "hv" -> "xw" shift.

therefore i think, that "wast" in the past time must be the pure form in balochi. "lot" is from indian languages the linguists say.

ps: in the presens time the stem for want is in kurdish: -xwaz-, in zazaki: waz-, in persian: -xwah-
here we can see again the northwest and southwest splitting. z = northwest, h = southwest

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Re: COMPARING: KURDISH & BALOCHI

PostAuthor: BalochEhr » Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:08 pm

To Johny Bravo,
I dont know about old persian or new persian. Lets discuss Kurdi and Balochi word meanings....we will discover a lot, big things are made of small things :)
Linguists say lot of things, i dont mean that they write in our favour, but they have messed with Brahui language. Calling it a Dravadian language and even they (linguists not anthropolgists) call Brahui speaking people "the western Dravadian people"...
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